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www.azstarnet.com ® | make us your home page mon, october 22, 2007 register now, it's free! get mobile access  | place an ad email newsletters  rss feeds   la estrellatucson.comcustomer service jobs cars real estate classifieds shopping past week (free) star archives classifieds home | tucson region | ua sports | sports | news | azstarbiz | opinion | accent | entertainment | neighborhoods | all headlines | blogs | obituaries site map contact us new! headlines from your zip code text size: download today's daily star front page pdf daily star photo store starnet is a part of lee enterprises sign up for arizona amber alerts terms of service copyright © 2007 comments on this story deserted core of el con mall may be razed outside, cars swarm the parking lot in front of target and home depot, and customers line up outside the in-n-out burger. but inside el con mall, occasional shoppers wander past roughly two dozen vacant storefronts and marvel at the eerie stillness. only show comments that are at least: 2 thumbs up 1 thumb up 0 thumbs up 1 thumb down 2 thumbs down 3 thumbs down 4 thumbs down 5 thumbs down view all filter profanity don't filter 1. comment by john m. (johnpn1) — september 23,2007 @ 12:20am rating: 1 thumb up i wish ross would just go away. they have the most annoying commercials that they repeat year after year.   2. comment by hollis g. (hollis) — september 23,2007 @ 12:44am rating: 23 thumbs up the interior mall is dead. the box stores (target, home depot), and the externalized movie theater, as well as the in n out and former krispy kreme (both out of the mall) virtually guarantee no one goes in. i went in two weeks ago to macy's and thought i was the only one in the store (btw, there's one only a few miles up the road at park mall). it was a quiet as that mall in dawn of the dead. i kept waiting for crazed zombies to come running after me at any moment.   3. comment by teresa f. (#4966) — september 23,2007 @ 1:22am rating: 31 thumbs up shame on the owners of the mall, they have let it run down. i talked to some business owners just before they left the mall and they were all upset. el con use to be a very beautiful and active mall so i just wonder if greed on the part of the owners has something to do with the disrepair in the mall. not all of us want to go to park place or tucson mall all the time. i miss el con and if the current owners can't or won't fix it up then sell it to someone that would.   4. comment by paul m. (midi) — september 23,2007 @ 3:16am rating: 9 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) time to tear it down and build an upscale super walmart!   5. comment by brian h. (#5479) — september 23,2007 @ 3:38am rating: 6 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) i like the word "raze".. especially when the word pertains to the city of tucson. next on the list to raze would be the entire row of warehouses on toole ave downtown.. then we can raze stone ave, the whole length of it. hmm, oracle rd south of river is up for razing; let's raze 6th ave too, oh and 22nd st would be fun to raze too.... razing ajo way and tucson electric park actually sounds like a good idea too..   6. comment by laura w. (early bird) — september 23,2007 @ 3:51am rating: 24 thumbs up for those who have lived here more than 25 years know that el con was originally an open air shopping center. it was shopping for the "eastside" and was upscale. it was enclosed around the time of park mall (now park place)inception, thus, both malls taking shoppers from downtown.   7. comment by ron j. (ronjon) — september 23,2007 @ 4:01am rating: 4 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) if you build it they will come.   8. comment by joseph s. (joseph siedel) — september 23,2007 @ 5:02am rating: 23 thumbs up el con withers and two new malls go up in marana... urban sprawl, anyone?   9. comment by chuck t. (soaz) — september 23,2007 @ 5:43am rating: 36 thumbs up early 60's-bored teenagers, hot summer nights, we'd cruise johnnie's, hang out in city parks shooting the breeze at midnight, even stroll through el con at midnight. guys and gals just hangin out, the guard would smile and wave. cops wouldn't even check you out in the parks. no shooting, muggings or dope. those were the days.   10. comment by paul h. (paul47) — september 23,2007 @ 6:18am rating: 23 thumbs up sounds like el con suffers from the same lack of insight and planning as the downtown redevelopment project.   11. comment by gary h. (#6099) — september 23,2007 @ 6:33am rating: 28 thumbs up the list of stores that have come and gone in el con ( they really should have stuck to the longer " el conquistador" name, one meaning "the conqueror" and the other..well..you get the picture)is legion. woolworths, cele peterson, gruenwald and adams, goldwaters, dillards, indian arts and crafts, chaparral indian stores, corral west and on and on and on. back in the 60s, when montgomery wards was the anchor for the mall there would be community events nearly every evening. cartoons were played on a screen for the kids while the parents shopped and there was even a cheap knock off of mcdonalds ( simply "donalds) that was quickly shut down under threat of lawsuit from the real golden arches.even in its later years, especially the late 80s and early 90s, there always seemed to something going on in the center walkway of the mall. art shows, sports shows, book sales, the mall had a flavor all its own. if blame for the demise of this once grand mall can be placed anywhere it should fall squarely at the feet of the papanikolas family for ignoring the upkeep on the mall on for strongarming the tenants they once had. as more and more stores refused to pony up more and more rent and moved out, the ones that stayed were forced to pay more to cover the gap in income lost by the flight of businesses out of el con. pity. this will be another bit of tucson history gone by the wayside..   12. comment by wilma w. (wilmawilcat) — september 23,2007 @ 6:44am rating: 30 thumbs up i remember el con when it was really busy. it was a great place to shop back then, especially living nearby in sam hughes. i was sad when goldwaters was bought out, and that seemed to be the beginning of the end -- to me, anyway. i used to love going to that little waldenbooks in there.   13. comment by nicole b. (njb) — september 23,2007 @ 6:53am rating: 26 thumbs up it really is sad to see this happen to this mall. i grew up here and remember alwayws going there as a kid. i remember eating in the upstairs restaurant at what used to be levy's and also in the little cafe in jc penney's. i also remember watching santa arrive with the tucson boys chorus leading the music. it used to be such a nice place to visiit. even though park mall was close by, the stores always did well. the biggest mistake was when montgomery wards closed and when dillards remodeled the park place store. the owners obviously did nothing to bring in new anchor tenants. instead they allowed home depot and target. how sad for what was once a beautiful and busy mall. i agree with number 11 another bit of history gone by the wayside.....   14. comment by robert s. (boxed tiger) — september 23,2007 @ 6:59am rating: 11 thumbs up the el con mall area falls under rio nuevo as an area...as a source of matchable revenues...tif monies should be available to raze, build, beautify the entire place... nothing is impossible with tif funding...   15. comment by ellen f. (#2575) — september 23,2007 @ 7:09am rating: 20 thumbs up the decline of el con can be tied directly to the poor management of the kivels and the pussy-footing around they've done with the mall for the past 20+ years. this is a facility that midtowners should support and work to save -- we don't want to travel to the fringes of the metro area to conduct commerce. boo kivels. yea el con.   16. comment by jac p. (tucsondeadhead) — september 23,2007 @ 7:14am rating: 7 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) convert the interior of the mall to artists' studios, tear down all the "historic" eyesore warehouses on toole and on the other side of the rr tracks, and move all the displaced artists to a newly named el conquistador arts centre. as for the empty food court, put in a bunch of fake dusty old buildings and make it look like a war-ravaged iraq and some paint-ball vendor can open it up to weekend warriors shooting it out in iraq-con.   17. comment by c b. (pwho) — september 23,2007 @ 7:26am rating: 16 thumbs up the easiest way out for bad corporate management of a mall is to blame other malls (like park place). they need to face the facts - that they chose long ago not to reinvest profits into continually redeveloping and renewing the mall. shoppers are always looking for a new experience and a good mall executive knows they need to keep re-vamping their product. at this point, they do need to think outside the box if they want to bring elcon back. it will take a bold idea; an open-aired approach (in the concept of the u of a's student union, for example) could work very well if it was done right.   18. comment by am g. (amg) — september 23,2007 @ 7:38am rating: 15 thumbs up el con and park mall co-existed for years successfully. i don't think park mall is to blame. i also grew up with el con. it was only a couple miles away from my home. i remember the main mall was the east end with wards in the front, palm trees down the center with the open-air covering that allowed the trees to grow through, the fountain at the north end, the cobbler, jeweler, kreske's (sp?) dime store. i remember when levy's was built, separate from the mall, and years later when they built the connecting part of the mall between wards and penny's. i opened my first charge account at wards and bought a little desk when i was 18. i used to buy my gas in front of wards with my credit card. i have a million memories of that mall. i hope someone who knows how to manage shopping centers can revitalize it. wouldn't it be cool to bring it back to its nostaligic original style? a nice breezeway?   19. comment by david c. (boardhead) — september 23,2007 @ 7:49am rating: 3 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) tear it down and turn the space in soccer fields; save the horse track.   20. comment by merle s. (#5415) — september 23,2007 @ 7:53am rating: 17 thumbs up the genesis of the problems at el con can be traced to papanikolas and kivel allowing the both park mall and el con to fall into disrepair. if the kivel family had not sold park mall, both properties would be an empty eyesore, not just el con.   21. comment by wayne k. (theamazingwayne) — september 23,2007 @ 7:55am rating: 3 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) [this comment has been removed]   22. comment by robert s. (boxed tiger) — september 23,2007 @ 7:58am rating: 14 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) [this comment has been removed]   23. comment by gary h. (#6099) — september 23,2007 @ 8:05am rating: 7 thumbs up #22> what an idiot!   24. comment by e i. (sanc) — september 23,2007 @ 8:14am rating: 15 thumbs up el con should be used as a case model for business schools on how to destroy a valuable asset. el con originally was a beautiful hotel rivaling anything in phoenix or scottsdale. the owners razed it to build a mall (the warehouses are near meaningless alongside the loss of the hotel). they tore it down to build a mall! consider how much nearby vacant land there was at the time. then the mall operated for a number of years fairly well until the mid-eighties when it started to show its age. the owners in there careful analysis, spent the next 15 yers running it into the ground. right now they could raze all of it, home depot, target, in-n-out, and macy's, and i still wouldn't miss it. park mall was the one many thought would falter, but they proved a little thought , and cash can go a long, long, long ways.   25. comment by ralph a. (cactusbob) — september 23,2007 @ 8:18am rating: 21 thumbs up i am surprised no one mentioned the problem with the little "gang bangers" in the 80's and 90's. they were all over that mall. thats why i quit shopping there.   26. comment by bob k. (ths) — september 23,2007 @ 8:21am rating: 9 thumbs up "a new successful concept is the mixed-use mall" with features such as office space and hotels in addition to retail and restaurants, he said. "that takes vision and agreement." add residential. there is enough real estate there to build lofts and townhouses for snowbirds, empty nesters, yuppies, even college students. people want to live near where they work, shop, dine and drink. of course, since phoenix is not doing this yet, tucson can't do it and still be like them.   27. comment by dave p. (dave11) — september 23,2007 @ 8:28am rating: 18 thumbs up el con mall is such a puzzle to me. el con has everything it needs, location, constant traffic on its bordering roads. yet it cannot figure out how to be successful. and it's so bloody obvious. some suggestions: first there's enough indoor space, make the rest into an outdoor mall. give people a break from the claustrophobia. in that space, put a brewpub with indoor and outdoor seating. rent space to popular local businesses at cut rates. hire some street artists -- jugglers, musicians, chalk drawers. give the place a sense of community. tucson will evidently never have the downtown pedestrian mall success stories like boulder, burlington, etc. so why can't a mall take advantage and make themselves into a place where people come not only to shop but to enjoy their day off?   28. comment by cindy r. (blackbeltmom) — september 23,2007 @ 8:35am rating: 6 thumbs up i can't believe that a nice historic-looking neighborhood has a mall like the el con! time to rip it down! put in some interesting shops, some good eateries that are unique and that appeal to a wide range of people...not just rich ones who buy expensive art and jewelry. anything's better than that dead, ugly-looking el con! when you travel to many other cities you see neat things in their "historic" areas. not big-box stores mixed with an outdated and deserted mall!   29. comment by steve g. (sgodwin) — september 23,2007 @ 8:57am rating: 18 thumbs up i agree with #24. i didn't live here until about a decade after the old hotel was demolished, but old photos show that the el conquistador resort was beautiful. it was a crime to raze it for the mall. and i, too, start shopping there less when the place was overrun with the gangbangers. no doubt the rise of internet shopping plays a role as well. but what surprises me is that the new stores and theatres were hoped to bring people to the mall, but they don't have any mall access. if you're at target or home depot, you have to leave through the parking lot and go over to the mall. makes no sense.   30. comment by dave p. (dave11) — september 23,2007 @ 9:12am rating: 9 thumbs up good point steve g. #29. what about a short tram between mall and those stores? would folks use it? would it cost too much? it's a new idea at least.   31. comment by ken o. (#2285) — september 23,2007 @ 9:15am rating: 2 thumbs up maybe we could just get away from malls and big box stores and return to local merchants for a refreshing change. those chain stores control what we can buy and won't do special orders. walmart? we used to be at war with communist china. now we support communism every time we shop there. i can't believe mccain advocates that! barry goldwater would have had a lot to say about walmart and dealing with the enemy.   32. comment by bill b. (#4485) — september 23,2007 @ 9:16am rating: 9 thumbs up put in some uniquie shops, out of the ordinary foods, something different from the others, aka north campbell and skyline, you'll draw a crowd. this said i was in park mall yesterday for a new pair of shoes, oh man, the parking lot was jammed! the stores were booming with business, i was lucky got it got it done an got out, with the help of a youngman who provided some excellent services in dillards. dropped my dollars and was on my way about the rest of the day. i'd go back. as for elcon, i remember it going up, the old hotel, the dances in the back, the hotel california look of the place, the long palm rows at the enterence. my mom used to work at this place some years back when it was the place. what has changed is the retailer itself. the c.pertsons have given way to the buy this from china stores, target, myrvens, sears/k-mart who is now one, kress used to be one of the original stores at elcon this became k-mart. now its sears or sears is k-mart, i get lost, who cares. could a "buy american mall" become successful, all products sold "made in america" there are levi jean company's that still produce jeans made in america (levi's is not one of them) wonder if you'd need a mall or one store to house these products. of course you'd need to have a sonoran style hotdog stand in the food court.   33. comment by lila s. (#2245) — september 23,2007 @ 9:21am rating: 13 thumbs up i agree with #18 that park mall and elcon co-exsisted for years, my brother and i as teens used to take the bus to el con then hop back on and take on park mall. i still think it should be an outlet mall, we need one on this side of town.   34. comment by bill b. (#4485) — september 23,2007 @ 9:23am rating: 9 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) raze broadway from elcon to the park mall, make it one huge three mile long mall, "the mall" a huge central market district, with the arts folks seeking space downtown, to hell with downtown let the technocrats have it, the rule it now with citystatefederaleverything. one very long large mall "like no other" with hotels, convention center, restraunts, live music, clubs, plays, bike or amusement concessions, some odd wave surf or similar item, a draw from the geographical region just to see this with some borrowed laser light shows from las vegas, "the place"   35. comment by bill b. (#4485) — september 23,2007 @ 9:23am rating: 5 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) "i'd go"   36. comment by gary h. (#6099) — september 23,2007 @ 9:30am rating: 16 thumbs up btw...my brother was working on an old house near speedway and 6th and found a 1935 tucson citizen stuck in the wall for insulation. i looked through the classifieds and under real estate there was an ad for 10 acres " adjacent to the el conquistador hotel". cost? aproximately $35.00 per acre.   37. comment by jason t. (#517) — september 23,2007 @ 9:33am rating: 14 thumbs up i think bad management is to blame here. the owners of this mall need to sell it. i mean come on, they live in salt lake city!!! they don't even care about tucson in my opinion. i think the way the owners allowed century theatres, home depot, and target to build was irresponsible. of course the interior of the mall will fail when there is no access to it. lets get this city together and tear this eyesore down. open it up and try to incorporate this retail space as one. el con mall and rio nuevo are exactly the same, nothing but idiots running them. marana and oro valley are now capitalizing on tucson's stupidity. congrats.   38. comment by us born 1. (us born) — september 23,2007 @ 9:48am rating: 0 thumbs up as the united states is overrun (after a plague) by millions of corpses who walk the earth as cannibalistic zombies. a small group of survivors, including a nurse and a police officer, try to find shelter within a massive shopping mall. but the zombies have a kind of sense memory and start arriving -- in droves -- for a shopping spree. dawn of the dead... what a movie   39. comment by bill b. (#4485) — september 23,2007 @ 10:18am rating: 8 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) us born1. interesting and what is the well dressed zombie wearing these days? is there a particluar company we should be paying attention to here?   40. comment by craig w. (cw) — september 23,2007 @ 10:21am rating: 9 thumbs up calls placed to the offices of joseph kivel's sons, lee and foster kivel, were not returned. how can anyone plot the course of a shopping mall when they can't even figure out how to return a phone call? have these guys stopped taking their meds?   41. comment by john c. (boobear) — september 23,2007 @ 10:25am rating: 8 thumbs up when you get families as soul owners, unfortunately the younger generation of these families have an entitlement attitude. so they never really supported the family business, never learned new ideas, therefore as a business there was no future. they are not losing money. the real estate by itself grew in value. they just could of generated much more. i propose an amusement park, complete with a high tech rollercoaster, water rides. have all the shops/parking underground to save space and keep it cool.   42. comment by phil d. (phild) — september 23,2007 @ 10:35am rating: 8 thumbs up keeping with the theme of "it's too bad/it's too late: the elegant el conquistador hotel could have been left standing and converted into beautiful and fun shops....instead the developers bought it, tore it down, and built an ugly box that became levy's. it has also been suggested before that the main library could have been installed in one of the large vacant stores at el con; instead taxpayers spent millions after the bizarre decision (made by the city council - not the kivels) to build it downtown, with little parking and the guarantee from any intelligent person that few people would use it.   43. comment by bobo a. (#4323) — september 23,2007 @ 10:38am rating: 10 thumbs up a target at one end, a tj maxx in the middle and a home depot at the other end, completely revived the mall in my parents town. there is also a tower records just outside the main mall - have to take about 15-20 feet from one exit to get there. the difference, as noted by #29, was that they actually put entrances to the mall in the "big box" stores. if i can't find something at target, i always go next door to home depot, or vs versa - just think if i got to walk past a bunch of stores on the way? as i recall, el con was actually enclosed as a reaction to park mall's air conditioned corridors. i would think that anything open air around here would have to have some sort of cooling. other than at the market, i think i saw two other people at la encantata during a visit this past july. other stores not mentioned - the college shop, dave bloom and sons, bakers and kinney's shoes, learners. woolworths was the place to stop for a soda between shopping. i do miss the place.   44. comment by john h. (landtuna) — september 23,2007 @ 10:58am rating: 7 thumbs up i remember leaving tucson in 1960 and taking one long, last look at the beautiful el con resort. to the idiots who tore down that landmark and replaced it with junk - hope you're still alive so you can see what your wonderful vision has become.   45. comment by liz t. (nickname) — september 23,2007 @ 11:12am rating: 11 thumbs up i live near el con and still shop at penney as well as the new outside stores. i think they should rebuild the hotel. right by a golf course, what could be better? i grew up in this area and remember not only the hotel, but how the outdoor facilities were turned into the first tucson racquet club. one of my fondest memories are the hot fudge sundaes at coffee dan's. they were enormous!!! at 18 i could get away with eating them. now, not so much.   46. comment by s w. (burgundy) — september 23,2007 @ 11:19am rating: 11 thumbs up i talked to one of the workers at a shop in el con when they were closing down and moving out. he said the rent had been raised again and that it was just too expensive to stay there. the company made the decision to pull that store out of the mall. not enough return on investment. so some of the stores were actually driven out. i always wondered if the management was just stupid or if they were driving the businesses out for a reason. i still don't know, but i know which way i'm leaning after reading all this.   47. comment by chris s. (wingedlionx) — september 23,2007 @ 11:28am rating: 1 thumb down [this comment has been removed]   48. comment by wayne k. (theamazingwayne) — september 23,2007 @ 11:39am rating: 2 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) 47 good idea but also firearms(the gop seems to like both)   49. comment by robert s. (boxed tiger) — september 23,2007 @ 11:40am rating: 10 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) yah bebe dis is vat i am talking about: the el con mall helped sweeten the deal for the tif funds from maricopa county coffers, but the layout stuck in the legislators throats there for few sessions...like a wierd wishbone...huffman's bill... the el con mall should be reinvested in as a monument to malls and our consumption in them. rio nuevo should provide funding for spectacles of art and entertainment and historical rehabilitation of our psuedo-historical interests...in the area. the el con mall is part of rio nuevo. it is ripe for reinvention, capital reinjection: mainlined rush like your first krispy creme...pump the bling!! bling!!! into el con now...   50. comment by harry d. (dog dude (blue heeler)) — september 23,2007 @ 12:11pm rating: 7 thumbs up what the mall owners don't seem to comprehend is a empty retail space is to the owner like unsold fruit to a fruit vendor. every month that a rent check does not come in is a loss. what el con needs is more shops that provide things the people want. if you can go to the same store three miles away why bother with el con when you have more choices almost next door. encourage specialty shops to move in, champs sports, the poster warehouse, a barber shop, a cobbler, carol's yogurt shoppe and a piercing pagoda is a start. entice a model & hobby shop, a good cappuccino place, a indoor cheep move theater that can only be entered from the mall, along with a causal restaurant or two so people can take the family out for a movie and dinner at a price the average working jane & joe can afford. a couple small bars, at least one a sports bar also a couple places where young kids can be dropped of for a couple of hours of fun without costing a arm and leg so the parents can enjoy shopping and or enjoying a nice lunch or dinner. bottom line, better to rent retail spaces at low profit so people can have places to shop and enjoy themselves then not rent them at all. people can buy wal-mart stuff anyplace, make el con the place for stuff and fun you can't get at wally world or the other malls   51. comment by b k. (#1724) — september 23,2007 @ 1:16pm rating: 8 thumbs up maybe the kivel's need the loss for tax avoidance?   52. comment by timothy c. (#4603) — september 23,2007 @ 1:42pm rating: 5 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) build it like park place and change name to english!   53. comment by mike s. (msouth07) — september 23,2007 @ 2:27pm rating: 2 thumbs up listen to a teenager for once! tucson (including it's metro area) is a city of over 1 million residents. what we lack is a place for young kids, teenagers, and even college students to go when we're bored. take a look at park place & tucson mall. i guarantee you one of the largest target markets is teenagers, because we're always there! why not completely gut the mall (or just tear it down) and build an inside or partially covered amusement park or carnival type attraction? huge world-record breaking rollercoasters are out of the question, because (1) they are too costly and (2) no one in the neighborhood around the mall would approve such large things being built. however an indoor, and maybe partially underground amusement park would be beneficial to this area. it would attract numerous amounts of people, and it would be different and new. it doesn't have to be a disneyland. think of it more like a county fair, but permanent and open year-round. they could involved the community too. have yearly passes. have special zip-code days where those from a chosen zip-code get admission free. create something new and exciting for tucson for once! stop the backward thinking. we don't need any more stores. park place and tucson mall have just about every store anyone could ever need between the two of them, so why invest money into building more stores just miles away from park place, when this property could be used for something new and that would generate a real profit.   54. comment by sherri f. (#2234) — september 23,2007 @ 3:02pm rating: 4 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) turn it into condos. the in out burger place should keep the prices high! lol   55. comment by elisabeth d. (#3500) — september 23,2007 @ 3:58pm rating: 2 thumbs up mall? what mall? i thought it was just a place for target, home depot, the theaters, in-n-out, rubios and starbucks to be built around. you mean there's actually a mall inside of there?   56. comment by s s. (whatthebuck) — september 23,2007 @ 4:17pm rating: 2 thumbs up i don't understand why anyone would invest millions of dollars into a place and then proceed to totally ignore it, at first i thought they were just confused as to where to start , then i thought it was benign neglect but now it's clear it's total disregard for what happens to it , if they don't care about this city then why don't they sell it to someone who does ? the first thing they did was make a lot of business owners leave by raising rents there , then they move the bus stop out to the street thereby not welcoming a lot of mall customers who use the bus to frequent the mall (seniors , teens, etc. ) , then they put in some lame food court and arcade place , close one wing , and then nothing lmao ! , this is a case study of how not to run a mall lol this was always my favorite mall and i used to go at least twice a week for shopping lunch and movies but i haven't been there in years now and i resent these people for what they have done to one of our landmarks ,i don't know anyone who goes there anymore , i mean who goes to a mall to go to a home depot anyway ? where are the store's ? i mean any kind of store's clothes books,shoes,music,movies,jewelry,restuaraunts,sports,games,.......anything really i'm not picky lol   57. comment by ellen f. (#2575) — september 23,2007 @ 4:42pm rating: 6 thumbs up the story says target occupies the former montgomery wards building. not. wards was leveled, and target is a brand new building.   58. comment by dan j. (dandyjones) — september 23,2007 @ 6:07pm rating: 3 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) another chick-fil-a. there is a god! awesome best lemonade ever!   59. comment by m. m. (meeeeeee) — september 23,2007 @ 6:54pm rating: 2 thumbs up i fail to see the point in investing money and then jumping ship either but then i don't have zillions to waste twiddling my thumbs while the mall just dies a slow death , i totally agree they handled this whole project wrong from the beginning , they did go out of their way to alienate neighbors and customers and even potential customers all at the same time , compare that with park place and see the difference , it's night and day,why buy a mall and then drive away your customer base it's beyond stupid lol i don't think an open air place would work in the summertime at least not for me lol but a mall without stores is like a zoo without animals lmao this used to be a fun place for the whole city to enjoy but they seem determined to drive everyone away ,why i'm not sure lmao   60. comment by dan j. (dandyjones) — september 23,2007 @ 7:00pm rating: 2 thumbs down this comment is below your threshold. (view comment) strip club   61. comment by am g. (amg) — september 23,2007 @ 9:24pm rating: 3 thumbs up does anyone remember tequila mockingbird? in my college years i used to go there to see the amature comedians during open mic night. it was a blast. that was in the later years of the mall's life. i think putting openings in the back of the big box stores that are entrances into the indoor mall is a great idea. people might be more likely to walk from home depot to target than to get in their cars and drive to the next store. they'd be passing all those fun and interesting stores in the meantime (if they happened to exist.)   62. comment by hilary f. (hilary) — september 23,2007 @ 10:39pm rating: 2 thumbs up remember a few years ago when linda ronstadt and cele peterson brought some urban landscape architects here to explain what needed to be done to save el con? acres of parking should not be the focal point. more trees, more pedestrian friendly amenities. make it look like a small town, not a 1950s mall. the mall owners were completely uninterested. they are getting what they deserve for being unwilling to innovate and realize that consumers' expectations have changedin the last 50 years. linda got disgusted with the small mindedness of her home town and moved back to california. cele peterson must be so disappointed to see the vibrant city of which she is a pillar to come to this.   63. comment by david b. (devinthegirl) — september 24,2007 @ 8:40am rating: 0 thumbs up no. 62, hilary... i do remember the designs that were presented. the problem is that they were not backed up by ms ronstadt and peterson with a proposal to purchase the property and embark on the project. form a company, write a business plan, garner investors etc. bottom line, it is private property, possibly even 'distressed' property. make them an offer! if the 40 or 50 people who have commented on this blog of 'what they should do' put up $10,000 each - the limited partners - coupled with a handful of high profile, high dollar individuals who would assume the role of major/general partners and go for it!! that is how you replace out of town, disconnected owners.   64. comment by jennifer b. (cali) — september 24,2007 @ 7:41pm rating: 1 thumb up given el con mall is one of the commercial properties in tucson dedicated to help fund the rio nuevo project through its tiff, seems to me that the city of tucson's mayor and council members should throw their backing to help expedite permits and abilities for the property to get things done quicker so that the retailers can get open and generating tax revenue. the city "leaders"; however, seemed to have thrown up more road blocks by giving the surrounding neighborhoods the abilty to "castrate" the project in a way that binds it from realizing its full potential. perhaps part of the effort is to dub it "downtown tucson's retail center", encouraging those who live and work downtown to use mass trasit along broadway to get to/from the property to frequent its restaurants and retail--now that might help show citizens some real leadership and vision for the community!   65. comment by jennifer b. (cali) — september 24,2007 @ 7:54pm rating: 2 thumbs up it appears from what has already been built along broadway at el con and the new ross building, that the ownership is committed to a quality end-product with block construction and nice architectural detail. it's obvious that the project is taking on the appearace of a hybrid development--a mix between a mall and a super power center, setting iteself apart from what park place has morphed into. it's exciting to see that the ownership sees it has an opportunity to do something like other cities offer with retail, restaurants and entertainment! these types of projects cannot happen overnight, especially when they have to work around existing retailers with existing contractural obligations. maybe we ought to give some gratitude to the ownership for thinking outside the "box" and making way for something differernt in tucson! i, too, grew up in tucson and shopped, ate and "cruised" el con from when it was once an open-air shoppping center to being an enclosed mall. interesting how retail trends have taken us back to the oepn air center concept as a viable place to enjoy the shopping experience. how about we stop complaining and encourage the city's elected officials and staff members to help this succeed. don't we all benefit in the end?!   66. comment by steve k. (kormy) — september 25,2007 @ 8:33am rating: 1 thumb down ignorance and greed. kivel's father dragged his ass with el con for years. the two sons do the same. to have such a huge parcel just sitting in the center of a major metropolitan city is a joke. the three owners and heirs need to sell the property to a corporation who knows how to update and develop the property. then they may spend their inheritance as they wish. they should be ashamed of letting this property go to hell in a handbasket. the former goldwater's building sitting empty is prime example of mismanagement by the kivel sons. their father would be ashamed.   67. comment by crystal s. (nervouscricket) — october 19,2007 @ 5:04pm rating: 0 thumbs up i remember a time when i prefered shopping at the el con mall over park mall. now, the only reason i go to el con is because it has a jc penney store. i have the feeling that if jc penney wasn't at el con, the mall would be a complete loss by now... more than it is already. i imagine target did not make a rear entrance into the mall because they were unsure if the mall would be there much longer. the new ross store did make a rear entrance into the mall, but as the article says, it was built with "outdoor-style details". it seems ross is planning for an "either-or" situation... i wish target had done the same thing. i was at ross for the grand opening and was surprised to see the store completely packed with eager shoppers. this proves that people want to shop at this location, they just have no stores to shop in. i can see the possibility of revitilization growing with every new business opening around the el con mall. the only problem is, with the exception of ross, that these businesses are not connecting to the mall. there has to be a reason why the store owners are distancing themselves from the mall. maybe there is a bigger picture that the developers have that we cannot see... i hope so, it's sad to see such a promising location wasting away. also, the comment about a county fair style amusement park doesn't too bad. i agree that local youth need a place to go for recreation. we need something other than stores and movie theatres to keep our kids entertained. developers should think about the needs of youth when planning in a community, i think it's very wise to listen to the teenagers, they are the future of our community.   leave a comment you are not logged in login to comment you may also write a letter to the editor. most commented stories for october 22, 2007 many want wide use of red-light cameras - 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